If We Allow Azerbaijan to Conduct Ethnic Cleansing, What Happened in 1915 Will Happen Again: Armenian President's Interview with BBC

The President of the Republic of Armenia, Armen Sarkissian, gave an interview to BBC's Arabic editorial team. According to the press service of the President’s office, this information was shared with Armenpress.

Question: Mr. President, we will talk about the tension between Armenia and Azerbaijan. Can you comment on this as a large-scale war?

Azerbaijan began shelling and bombing not only the border but also deeper into the territory along the entire length of the Nagorno-Karabakh Republic’s borders on the morning of September 27, including schools and so on. A large number of civilians were injured, from grandmothers to small children, various buildings were destroyed, and enormous damage is being inflicted every day. After all this, I leave it to you to decide whether this is a large-scale war or not.

The Armenian side did not initiate any of this. Moreover, the Armenian side in this case is not the Republic of Armenia but the Nagorno-Karabakh Republic, Artsakh. This is a small country with 150,000 inhabitants, which has been here for thousands of years. It was forced by Joseph Stalin to be part of Soviet Azerbaijan. During the collapse of the Soviet Union, the people decided that they are the masters of their own fate since over 90 percent of the population in Nagorno-Karabakh were Armenians. They voted through a referendum to live in an independent state.

On the other hand, it is Azerbaijan, which has finances and strength, a population of 10 million and a friend like Turkey. They are trying to force Armenians to leave the territory where Armenians have historically lived since before Azerbaijan existed as a state. In my vocabulary, this is called ethnic cleansing—forcing people to leave simply because they belong to another ethnicity, they do not fit into this or that classification. Is this large-scale war or not? I believe it is. This is a blood-soaked war, a war of a small but proud people— a people that has proven that it can fight and can never be defeated. They won against Azerbaijan in the previous war. I don’t understand why Azerbaijan has chosen to solve the issue through the ethnic cleansing of the Armenian people of Nagorno-Karabakh instead of negotiating and engaging at the international negotiating table.

Question: What is your view on the role of the OSCE Minsk Group?

The OSCE Minsk Group has played a huge and very important role over the past 26 years since the 1994 ceasefire. First of all, it is a highly respected international organization with three co-chairs: Russia, France, and the United States. They work tirelessly with both sides to bring about a final diplomatic or political resolution to the problem. Therefore, I highly appreciate their work. Of course, in any negotiations in this world—political, military, or business—you cannot always plan for success and achieve your goal. There are ups and downs in negotiations. However, in these negotiations, one must be patient. Sometimes one side of the negotiations is satisfied, sometimes it is not; sometimes you think that you are losing and the opposite is true. Negotiations must be brought to a conclusory end, signed through a final document, and thereafter put great efforts into making the signed agreement materialize.

It is absolutely inhumane and not normal to leave the negotiating table and try to solve the problem through military force.

Question: You spoke very well and highly appreciated the OSCE, but you continue to reject the Russian initiative to end this tension.

I don’t know who gave you that idea; that idea is not correct. Russia has addressed both sides to cease the incidents and for a ceasefire, which is normal. However, there is no mechanism in place. To stop any military actions or wars, you must have clear mechanisms. This is a complex process. This is one. It is still not in action.

Not only Russia, but also the United States, the EU, France, and many countries have called on both Armenia and Azerbaijan—in saying Armenia, I also mean the people of the Nagorno-Karabakh Republic—to cease the war. However, to stop the war, one must apply pressure on the aggressor—which in this case, the military operations and war have been initiated by Azerbaijan, not the people of Nagorno-Karabakh; they have no desire to start another war. It is not right to address both sides since it is Azerbaijan that started the war, and pressure must be applied to them to cease the war. The moment they cease, the Armenian side will do the same.

Question: Turkey has stated that it will support Azerbaijan. Does this mean that Armenia will also try to seek external military support?

Again, I want to emphasize that the issue is with the Armenians of Nagorno-Karabakh, not with Armenia. Turkey supports Azerbaijan. Frankly, I would very much like Turkey to support Azerbaijan in education, culture, science, technology, and building relations. I would like Turkey to remember its history, try to recognize that 105 years ago the last Armenian genocide took place in the Ottoman Empire. Try to establish or improve relations with Armenia. Instead of doing all this, they simply refuse to accept that a genocide occurred. Because they deny this, we have no diplomatic relations. Turkey is not just supporting Azerbaijan; they have become part of the conflict, as they have sent military equipment, advisors, finances, and weapons to Azerbaijan. Certainly, as always, Turkey is trying to somehow fool the international community. They have done this a lot in the cases of Syria, Iraq, and Libya, and constantly tell the story of PKK fighters. In our case, they say that they are there to protect the international energy boundary. This is completely absurd. These international energy pipelines that reach from Baku to Ceyhan were built 20 years ago. If the Armenians of Nagorno-Karabakh or Armenia wanted to fire toward these, they would have done it 20 years ago, not now. If we had stopped the operation of that gas pipeline 20 years ago, Azerbaijan would not have earned billions of dollars in the next 20 years to buy ammunition and fire on Armenians, killing them. But we did not do that. The Armenians of Nagorno-Karabakh did not fire at that gas pipeline because we respect international laws.

This is a conflict between Azerbaijan and Armenians who believe that they have the right to self-determination just like all other nations, like former Yugoslav States, Scotland. The Armenians of Nagorno-Karabakh say that they held a referendum by law. Azerbaijan’s response to all this is a medieval response: war, instead of respecting the will of those people.

Question: What future do you envision? How is Armenia connected with Nagorno-Karabakh, do you have a responsibility toward them?

Of course! If Turkey says that it has certain ethnic ties with Azerbaijan, the same Armenians live in Nagorno-Karabakh. Historically, Armenia has been larger. They are Armenians who have lived there for thousands of years. Not only Armenians living in Armenia, but all Armenians around the world have a responsibility because if we allow the Azerbaijani side to carry out ethnic cleansing, something will happen just like what happened in the Ottoman Empire in 1915, when Armenians were simply annihilated and driven from their historical homeland. Their homes, churches, towns were destroyed, and there is no Armenian culture left. Not only 1.5 million people died but also a huge cultural heritage and culture was annihilated. Can we allow this history to repeat itself?

Question: Would you accept a UN peacekeeping mission or a UN Security Council resolution on a ceasefire?

This issue has a 26-year history. The issue of a UN peacekeeping mission has been discussed continuously. However, both sides have more or less managed to live in ceasefire conditions during these 26 years, which have been breached on several occasions. Both sides are capable of sitting and negotiating. If that wasn’t the case, I would say it is impossible to negotiate; we would tell Russia or other powers to come stand between us. At this moment, there is an internationally recognized organization: the OSCE Minsk Group. There is also the UN. If these organizations come forward with proposals, they should first address the Azerbaijani side, which has restarted these military operations. Armenians were not even thinking of starting such actions on September 27 in Nagorno-Karabakh, in Armenia. Thus, if the UN, OSCE, EU, NATO—of which Turkey is a member—apply pressure on Azerbaijan to cease the military operations, the Armenians will be the first to agree to that.